My first encounter with Lagbaja’s music was with his self-titled album “Lagbaja!” in 1994. The deep lyrics of songs such as “Side by side”, “Naija must sweet again” got to me and other songs from subsequent albums – “Coolu Temper” and the triple album – really got me addicted to the phenomenon called Lagbaja. So much was this addiction that I wrote my final project in school (to the chagrin of my supervisor who still gave me an ‘A’ anyway) on how Lagbaja’s audience perceives his music which I find really stimulating intellectually.
Apart from a few songs from his last album, I pride myself on knowing all of Lagbaja’s songs. Like most Lagbaja addicts (I know more than a few), I have been to ‘Motherlan’ on Opebi in Ikeja, Lagos where Lagbaja plays every other last Friday of the month. Lagbaja has not played in Motherlan for sometime now and when I visited the place a few months back to purchase some of his CDs, there was no one in sight. A visit to his official website www.lagbaja.com has also yielded no result. Hence the question: where is Lagbaja? If like me you are also wondering and waiting for answers, then I suggest you seek solace in this never-been-published incisive interview I had with Lagbaja a few years back in Motherlan. He talked about the Lagbaja concept, his music, aspirations and pertinent issues like corruption, slavery, reparation and so on. Enjoy!
This is a beautiful mask you have on. Who designs them?
I design some of them myself. Right now I’m looking for a new designer. The last time I had a designer was 1994. But for the past few years, I have been doing the designs myself. You know this is Africa and the fabrics abound. All one needs to do is to get the right fabric and do the designing.
Apart from a few songs from his last album, I pride myself on knowing all of Lagbaja’s songs. Like most Lagbaja addicts (I know more than a few), I have been to ‘Motherlan’ on Opebi in Ikeja, Lagos where Lagbaja plays every other last Friday of the month. Lagbaja has not played in Motherlan for sometime now and when I visited the place a few months back to purchase some of his CDs, there was no one in sight. A visit to his official website www.lagbaja.com has also yielded no result. Hence the question: where is Lagbaja? If like me you are also wondering and waiting for answers, then I suggest you seek solace in this never-been-published incisive interview I had with Lagbaja a few years back in Motherlan. He talked about the Lagbaja concept, his music, aspirations and pertinent issues like corruption, slavery, reparation and so on. Enjoy!
This is a beautiful mask you have on. Who designs them?
I design some of them myself. Right now I’m looking for a new designer. The last time I had a designer was 1994. But for the past few years, I have been doing the designs myself. You know this is Africa and the fabrics abound. All one needs to do is to get the right fabric and do the designing.
What inspires your designs?
I’m inspired mostly by what I see in the society. And again, because of the arts, there are some things that are very important. The most important thing is the voice. The voice has to be clear. But the mask is a great hindrance to voice clarity. It muffles the voice. If I pull this back a little bit, you will hear me a bit clearer. This has to do with acoustics. The mask has to be designed in a way that, although the face is covered, the voice is clear so I don’t sing distorted. I’ve got to be able to hear myself on stage; so the ears have to be open. The challenge is in being able to design a mask that covers the face as it should be, is very secured, comfortable so I can wear it for hours and at the same time gives room for good acoustics and for me to hear. That’s the basic thing. The rest is aesthetics.
I’ve heard you reiterate severally that anyone could be behind the mask as Lagbaja. Right?
Anybody because Lagbaja is anybody.
Irrespective of who is behind the mask, what is the personality of Lagbaja?
First the message has to stay the same. And this has mostly to do with social political commentary awareness songs. The personality has to be able to project what Lagbaja stands for by his act. In a nutshell, I’ll say that is the basic thing. The next thing is the quality of musicianship. If he’s a singer, he has to b a good singer. Lagbaja could be a guitarist; he has to be a good guitarist. Whatever he does, he has to do to the best of his ability. That is the basic in terms of performance. Everything else…anything…anybody…you know…he could be short, he could be you know…a bit ‘orobo’ (big) like you. He could be tall.
What does Lagbaja stand for musically?
Two things variably. One is deep messages. I have to say something to the soul of my listeners. The other is simple entertainment. To make them happy, take away their sorrows for the time that they are listening to my music. They are two almost extreme ends. I project both very important functions with my music.
I’m inspired mostly by what I see in the society. And again, because of the arts, there are some things that are very important. The most important thing is the voice. The voice has to be clear. But the mask is a great hindrance to voice clarity. It muffles the voice. If I pull this back a little bit, you will hear me a bit clearer. This has to do with acoustics. The mask has to be designed in a way that, although the face is covered, the voice is clear so I don’t sing distorted. I’ve got to be able to hear myself on stage; so the ears have to be open. The challenge is in being able to design a mask that covers the face as it should be, is very secured, comfortable so I can wear it for hours and at the same time gives room for good acoustics and for me to hear. That’s the basic thing. The rest is aesthetics.
I’ve heard you reiterate severally that anyone could be behind the mask as Lagbaja. Right?
Anybody because Lagbaja is anybody.
Irrespective of who is behind the mask, what is the personality of Lagbaja?
First the message has to stay the same. And this has mostly to do with social political commentary awareness songs. The personality has to be able to project what Lagbaja stands for by his act. In a nutshell, I’ll say that is the basic thing. The next thing is the quality of musicianship. If he’s a singer, he has to b a good singer. Lagbaja could be a guitarist; he has to be a good guitarist. Whatever he does, he has to do to the best of his ability. That is the basic in terms of performance. Everything else…anything…anybody…you know…he could be short, he could be you know…a bit ‘orobo’ (big) like you. He could be tall.
What does Lagbaja stand for musically?
Two things variably. One is deep messages. I have to say something to the soul of my listeners. The other is simple entertainment. To make them happy, take away their sorrows for the time that they are listening to my music. They are two almost extreme ends. I project both very important functions with my music.
You made ‘Lagbaja!’ in 1994, ‘Coolu Temper’ in 1996, why did it take you five years to release another album?
I’m never in a hurry to release albums. But I’m always documenting my works. A release is just marketing a product. I’ve been recording some songs since 1999 and they didn’t make the last album releases we had. There are songs that didn’t make the album but they are still there because I’m always recording. They might make the next album or the next set of albums. And when that happens people might wonder…three years! Four years! But it doesn’t matter to me. The most important thing is that I still find time to document my works and when it’s time to bring them out for people to listen to, that’s the marketing aspect of it. So I would say it is sales and marketing that determine the timing of release. But I’m always documenting even when nothing is in the market. Another reason is that there is really no encouragement for releasing albums in this country because it’s really creating market for pirates more or less because they make all the money. So one is not eager to do anything.
I’m never in a hurry to release albums. But I’m always documenting my works. A release is just marketing a product. I’ve been recording some songs since 1999 and they didn’t make the last album releases we had. There are songs that didn’t make the album but they are still there because I’m always recording. They might make the next album or the next set of albums. And when that happens people might wonder…three years! Four years! But it doesn’t matter to me. The most important thing is that I still find time to document my works and when it’s time to bring them out for people to listen to, that’s the marketing aspect of it. So I would say it is sales and marketing that determine the timing of release. But I’m always documenting even when nothing is in the market. Another reason is that there is really no encouragement for releasing albums in this country because it’s really creating market for pirates more or less because they make all the money. So one is not eager to do anything.
A lot of your songs address societal ills. How do you think you songs can make the right impact in the society?
That’s a tough one to answer. The best I can do is express myself. There are many possibilities. One aspect of it is in terms of class strata…the easiest so far has been on the masses. But the more difficult one which actually can lead to the bigger impact is to access the mind of the ruling class…the leaders. Sometimes I do songs that are specifically written for them. Like ‘A o m’erin j’oba’ (we’ll make the elephant king) is telling the leaders a very serious message. A song like ‘Bad leadership’ is also directed at them. But then, you have songs that could mean different things to different people. That’s one way. Another way is through performance of the songs. We get to perform a lot at some kind of exclusive functions where you have so called ‘big men’…politicians and in the days of the military, sometimes military leaders. Usually our employer might not be happy with the singing of those songs, but I think by and large, they have come to accept that it’s just a part of Lagbaja. A third aspect of it which I’ve not had enough of is with the student population. They constitute a large chunk of our fans but we have not been playing much on campuses because of the ups and downs; the evils you know…cultism and the like. But we’ll love to do more of campus shows. The few we’ve done, I’ve been able to break in the middle of the show and talked. It’s not yabis now. It’s talk. The nearest thing to it probably will be like to go to church and listen to some kind of message. It’s more to do with ‘the person’ rather than some yabis targeted at so called ‘government people’ ruining the country. I talk to them like some self-help thing from what I know and understand about life. I communicate with them and hope that some couple of guys in the audience will go home with something that’s going to change their lives for better. But it’s not church because we don’t call anybody to the altar. But the nearest thing to it is church because it is motivational. Those are the forms we use in communicating the serious messages. The fun songs need no serious communication. You hear them and you move and that works.
That’s a tough one to answer. The best I can do is express myself. There are many possibilities. One aspect of it is in terms of class strata…the easiest so far has been on the masses. But the more difficult one which actually can lead to the bigger impact is to access the mind of the ruling class…the leaders. Sometimes I do songs that are specifically written for them. Like ‘A o m’erin j’oba’ (we’ll make the elephant king) is telling the leaders a very serious message. A song like ‘Bad leadership’ is also directed at them. But then, you have songs that could mean different things to different people. That’s one way. Another way is through performance of the songs. We get to perform a lot at some kind of exclusive functions where you have so called ‘big men’…politicians and in the days of the military, sometimes military leaders. Usually our employer might not be happy with the singing of those songs, but I think by and large, they have come to accept that it’s just a part of Lagbaja. A third aspect of it which I’ve not had enough of is with the student population. They constitute a large chunk of our fans but we have not been playing much on campuses because of the ups and downs; the evils you know…cultism and the like. But we’ll love to do more of campus shows. The few we’ve done, I’ve been able to break in the middle of the show and talked. It’s not yabis now. It’s talk. The nearest thing to it probably will be like to go to church and listen to some kind of message. It’s more to do with ‘the person’ rather than some yabis targeted at so called ‘government people’ ruining the country. I talk to them like some self-help thing from what I know and understand about life. I communicate with them and hope that some couple of guys in the audience will go home with something that’s going to change their lives for better. But it’s not church because we don’t call anybody to the altar. But the nearest thing to it is church because it is motivational. Those are the forms we use in communicating the serious messages. The fun songs need no serious communication. You hear them and you move and that works.
I know two young people who go by the name Lagbaja for different reasons. Do you see yourself as a role model to younger people?
Even if I don’t see myself as one, as long as you are a public figure and you are in the arts, you know…playing music, there is no way you will not affect the lives of other people. So in a way, you could say a role model. I can’t help it but I just hope to be a positive role model.
Was there ever a time you felt like being identified as yourself and not the guy behind the mask?
No! But I’ve felt a little bit bad at times when I want to interact me with people and somehow, something about the mask doesn’t project friendliness. This happens a lot when I perform at festivals with other African musicians. They believe I must be some sort of monk or holy man that they can only talk to me with reverence. They really can’t hug me. I hug them, they are surprised. You know…they are a bit reluctant but they want to know about me. The mask sometimes makes fast, easy communication, and friendliness a bit slower.
How spiritual is Lagbaja?
The whole of life is about being spiritual. If you appreciate that the most powerful part of creation has three beings, then you will know that the physical being is under the influence of what happens in the spirit. I think anybody who appreciates that won’t help but be spiritual.
Even if I don’t see myself as one, as long as you are a public figure and you are in the arts, you know…playing music, there is no way you will not affect the lives of other people. So in a way, you could say a role model. I can’t help it but I just hope to be a positive role model.
Was there ever a time you felt like being identified as yourself and not the guy behind the mask?
No! But I’ve felt a little bit bad at times when I want to interact me with people and somehow, something about the mask doesn’t project friendliness. This happens a lot when I perform at festivals with other African musicians. They believe I must be some sort of monk or holy man that they can only talk to me with reverence. They really can’t hug me. I hug them, they are surprised. You know…they are a bit reluctant but they want to know about me. The mask sometimes makes fast, easy communication, and friendliness a bit slower.
How spiritual is Lagbaja?
The whole of life is about being spiritual. If you appreciate that the most powerful part of creation has three beings, then you will know that the physical being is under the influence of what happens in the spirit. I think anybody who appreciates that won’t help but be spiritual.
Do you go to church, mosque?
Lagbaja no dey go anywhere. Lagbaja is Lagbaja. But the guys wey dey behind Lagbaja, dem dey go church o.
Are you fulfilled with the acceptance of your music?
I’m happy with it. I have a long way to go. I have a big dream. As far as I’m concerned, I’m nowhere right now.
That’s being modest.
I’m serious my sister. I just pray that God gives me the strength and the might. You know…beginners class la wa yi (we are in beginners class). I tell people all the time especially in interviews but they don’t seem to believe me. There is too much hype about African music. The hype is bigger than the reality. We are beginners. We are nowhere. I have a dream and a vision to be in the forefront of having African music as big as any other music from any part of the world.
Where do you see yourself musically in the next ten years?
By the grace of God, I will love to see my music performed and studied by non-Yorubas, non-Nigerians and at large non-Africans. I’ll love to see that happen. If it pleases God, I’ll love to see a situation where there is a real music industry in Nigeria in ten years time. Just a couple of dreams among several dreams. Ten years time and let’s see how things work out.
Lagbaja no dey go anywhere. Lagbaja is Lagbaja. But the guys wey dey behind Lagbaja, dem dey go church o.
Are you fulfilled with the acceptance of your music?
I’m happy with it. I have a long way to go. I have a big dream. As far as I’m concerned, I’m nowhere right now.
That’s being modest.
I’m serious my sister. I just pray that God gives me the strength and the might. You know…beginners class la wa yi (we are in beginners class). I tell people all the time especially in interviews but they don’t seem to believe me. There is too much hype about African music. The hype is bigger than the reality. We are beginners. We are nowhere. I have a dream and a vision to be in the forefront of having African music as big as any other music from any part of the world.
Where do you see yourself musically in the next ten years?
By the grace of God, I will love to see my music performed and studied by non-Yorubas, non-Nigerians and at large non-Africans. I’ll love to see that happen. If it pleases God, I’ll love to see a situation where there is a real music industry in Nigeria in ten years time. Just a couple of dreams among several dreams. Ten years time and let’s see how things work out.
How rich is Lagbaja?
Rich in spirit, poor in the pocket.
How poor?
Quite poor. So poor he really can’t do all the things he needs to do.
Things like what?
Poverty is relative. My basic needs are met but my vision is beyond my power. It’s beyond what I can afford and the distractions of the country make it impossible for me to concentrate on those things which I find most important. For example, investing money in studio equipment should only happen when one is loaded and can afford it. But for me, it is a necessity just to be able to record some good quality. Those things make it impossible for me to be able to hold on to money. It just passes through…always passing through. K’o ma dabi epe (may it not seem like a curse) but that is the fact. It’s always passing through. You can’t seem to hold it down. But the more one goes, I believe the better it will become. If you are talking about real wealth from music, where do you want to find it? With how many CD sales? When the pirates are selling the bulk of your CDs? When you talk of five million CDs for example in a developing economy, now you are talking. You can afford not to perform fro three years.
Hmmm!
Oh yeah! Five million CDs! Even if you get $1 per CD.
That’s five million Dollars!
Thank you. That’s real wealth. Not to talk about endorsements appearances, live gigs and so on. So we are really beginners here.
Do you see yourself in competition with any artiste?
I am in total competition with Lagbaja and only with Lagbaja. But I am also inspired by the music and success of other artistes. No competition. It doesn’t mean I think I’m superior. No! I just refuse the spirit of rivalry. It is retrogressive. I do my thing to the best of my ability. My goal is to be the best I can be. Always striving to be the best I can be.
Rich in spirit, poor in the pocket.
How poor?
Quite poor. So poor he really can’t do all the things he needs to do.
Things like what?
Poverty is relative. My basic needs are met but my vision is beyond my power. It’s beyond what I can afford and the distractions of the country make it impossible for me to concentrate on those things which I find most important. For example, investing money in studio equipment should only happen when one is loaded and can afford it. But for me, it is a necessity just to be able to record some good quality. Those things make it impossible for me to be able to hold on to money. It just passes through…always passing through. K’o ma dabi epe (may it not seem like a curse) but that is the fact. It’s always passing through. You can’t seem to hold it down. But the more one goes, I believe the better it will become. If you are talking about real wealth from music, where do you want to find it? With how many CD sales? When the pirates are selling the bulk of your CDs? When you talk of five million CDs for example in a developing economy, now you are talking. You can afford not to perform fro three years.
Hmmm!
Oh yeah! Five million CDs! Even if you get $1 per CD.
That’s five million Dollars!
Thank you. That’s real wealth. Not to talk about endorsements appearances, live gigs and so on. So we are really beginners here.
Do you see yourself in competition with any artiste?
I am in total competition with Lagbaja and only with Lagbaja. But I am also inspired by the music and success of other artistes. No competition. It doesn’t mean I think I’m superior. No! I just refuse the spirit of rivalry. It is retrogressive. I do my thing to the best of my ability. My goal is to be the best I can be. Always striving to be the best I can be.
In ‘Afrocalypso’, you sang about the enslavement of the bodies of your ancestors. What is your opinion of slavery in Africa?
There is still slavery today. I mean…physical slavery, mental slavery is the worse, economic slavery is the worst of them all. We can only hope that we start to wake up out of this mess. But there is still slavery till today. You read stories of children being taken from their country in boats to other places. That’s slavery! Kids for sale across the border. The only difference between then and now is that there is a connivance of parents and guardians in several cases of the young kids. In those days, it was force and the parents themselves were victims sometimes. The problem has to do with out level of poverty and enlightenment. But apart from that I think mental and economic slavery are bigger. We still depend on the outside world for so many thing things. And you can see the president saying that he’s tired of working with IMF. He wants to disengage. He wants to break the slavery. But instantly they will look for another way. The more we are disarrayed, the happier they are. They are not our friends at all. Everything boils down to selfish ends. It might sound cynical but that’s the fact. But they are not holding us down. They are not stopping us from thinking for ourselves. We are the ones not getting ourselves together. And they are not the ones who will help us out of our physical, mental and economic slavery. We have to work that out ourselves.
There is still slavery today. I mean…physical slavery, mental slavery is the worse, economic slavery is the worst of them all. We can only hope that we start to wake up out of this mess. But there is still slavery till today. You read stories of children being taken from their country in boats to other places. That’s slavery! Kids for sale across the border. The only difference between then and now is that there is a connivance of parents and guardians in several cases of the young kids. In those days, it was force and the parents themselves were victims sometimes. The problem has to do with out level of poverty and enlightenment. But apart from that I think mental and economic slavery are bigger. We still depend on the outside world for so many thing things. And you can see the president saying that he’s tired of working with IMF. He wants to disengage. He wants to break the slavery. But instantly they will look for another way. The more we are disarrayed, the happier they are. They are not our friends at all. Everything boils down to selfish ends. It might sound cynical but that’s the fact. But they are not holding us down. They are not stopping us from thinking for ourselves. We are the ones not getting ourselves together. And they are not the ones who will help us out of our physical, mental and economic slavery. We have to work that out ourselves.
All Africans. In Africa, diaspora, everybody. But I think...as a matter of fact, everybody should be paid. They suffered and we suffered too. But we were also guilty too…small you know. But everybody should be paid. It is our money. All you have to do is look at those countries and imagine where the wealth came from. A lot of our wealth has been used to develop their society, but the wealth is unending. There was no oil inlarge quantity till the 70s. It’s new wealth. What have we done with that new wealth even if they took our old wealth away a long time ago? Fighting, corruption, chopping…it’s all crazy. So all that history of giving reparation…sometimes you find it like a terrible cycle. Because you are looking to be repaid, meanwhile you were a part of the problem and you are still creating the same situation today; even a worse situation. So who would pay back the future generation for what we are destroying right now. It’s a knotty issue. But if anyone wants to bring money to pay anybody, it has to be all Africans. Those right here, in Barbados, Trinidad & Tobago, Cuba, Brazil, America, all over the world.
In Nigeria…
Of course!
And including Lagbaja…
Hmm! I will say I have a little of my own reparation because I grew up at a time when we had leaders that had depth. And what they put you through for even basic education is enough reparation for me. There is nothing you can do beyond enlightening a soul and they did that. So it’s not a personal thing. It has more to do with everyone at large.
What scares you most in life?
Scares…scares…scares…the future of the young generation. What will happen after we are gone? I think I am very scared about that. Because right now, I can afford to send my own kids to Stanford, Harvard and Cambridge. What about the average kid? Schools are shut, cultism, lecturers are on strike, no lab equipment, it’s just pass and go, pass and go. So what happens twenty years from now when we keep digging our own graves?
Do you have any regrets so far?
No. Not yet. It think it is normal for regrets to come sometimes, but so far, right now, not yet. But I’m waiting; I’m expecting the day that I’ll say ‘Oh I should have done a different thing.’ But for now, none.
It was nice talking to you.
It’s a pleasure my sister.
